June 7, 2024
An Embarrassingly Simple Way to Manage Stress with Anastsis Tzanis
Feeling stressed and unable to cope? Discover how breathwork can transform your mental and physical well-being, offering a balanced, resilient state of being.
Do you ever feel stressed and overwhelmed, unable to cope with life's demands?
Many people struggle with managing stress and anxiety, leading to physical and mental health issues. However, there's a simple yet powerful solution that has been practiced for thousands of years – breathwork.
Anastasis, a breathwork expert, shares how breathwork can help you regain control and achieve a balanced, resilient state of being.
BY THE TIME YOU FINISH LISTENING, YOU'LL DISCOVER:
- How different breathing techniques can influence your body's biochemistry and neurotransmitter levels, reducing anxiety and stress
- The link between genetic factors, like catecholamine breakdown enzymes, and anxiety, and how breathwork can help manage these conditions
- How breathwork can complement treatments for autoimmune conditions and cancer, improving cellular oxygenation and mitochondrial health
Breathwork is a holistic approach that can empower you to take control of your well-being, no matter your cultural background or personal circumstances. If you're ready to embark on a journey of self-healing, this episode will provide you with invaluable insights.
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Chapters
00:00 - Breathwork and Stress Management Benefits
09:12 - Breathwork for Stress and Health
19:00 - Benefits of Breathwork for Health
Transcript
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The ones that did breathing exercises that helped them improve their score in this test had a significantly longer life expectancy than the ones that didn't Like, significantly.
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I don't remember if it was 60% more or even more than double.
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So some of them they did breathing exercises first thing in the morning.
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They measured their score, they improved their breathing.
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They lived longer.
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Welcome to Pivoting Pharmacy with Nutrigenomics, part of the Pharmacy Podcast Network, a must-have resource for pharmacist entrepreneurs seeking to enhance patient care while enjoying career and life.
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Join us as we pivot into nutrigenomics, using pharmacy and nutrition for true patient-focused care.
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Using pharmacy and nutrition for true patient-focused care.
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Explore how to improve chronic conditions rather than just manage them.
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Celebrate entrepreneurial triumphs and receive priceless advice.
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Align your values with a career that profoundly impacts patients.
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Together, we'll raise the script on health and pivot into a brighter future.
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Hello and welcome to Pivoting Pharmacy with Nutrigenomics.
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I'm Dr Tamar, lawful doctor of pharmacy and certified nutritional genomics specialist.
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You know, this morning I was juggling my cup of coffee and reading my emails the onslaught of emails between my personal email account, my business email account.
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It seemed like a lot to do before my day even really began and I couldn't help but feel a knot of stress tightening in my chest.
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Have you guys ever felt that before you know you have so much to do and you feel so stressed?
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We've all been there right.
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In this nonstop world, finding calm can seem like looking for a needle in a haystack.
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Well, I have some good news for you.
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Things are about to get a whole lot more hopeful because we're diving into the world of breath work with Anastasis Tzazani, a true guru in the art of intentional breathing.
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He's here to show us how to harness the power of our breath to ease our minds and soothe our bodies.
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Stick with us and let's get ready to exhale our way to tranquility.
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Listen in, anastasis.
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Thank you for joining us today on Pivoting Pharmacy with Neutrogenomics.
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I'm looking forward to speaking with you.
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Could you just start us off by telling us what led you to where you are today?
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Where did it all start?
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Where did it begin?
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Sure.
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Thanks very much for having me.
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I'm looking forward to our conversation.
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The journey goes back probably like 30 years, and it was the time that I was starting, as a young man in Greece, my professional life.
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I joined the special forces there for one year.
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I was looking for the stimulation that will come with it, the physical challenge that would come with it, and that was very well satisfied.
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But I was not as happy as I was hoping and it was at a time that I was missing the mental stimuli.
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Fast forward six years.
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I was then in banking.
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I was in London at the time and I was a currency derivatives trader, so a very different environment, not physical at all, but very mentally stimulating.
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And again, I was not very happy.
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I was seeing my health deteriorating and a lot of the problems that maybe some of our audience are facing of a sedentary life, successful career, and at the time I looked into yoga, nutritional therapy as well, which is what I start studying on the side of being in banking as a way to find the answers for the problems that I was facing with my health.
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And once I start seeing the benefits, then I said, ok, you know what?
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Maybe that's the reason why I went down this path.
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It's time for me to delve deeper, share what I've learned and the benefits that I experienced myself with others, and that's what set me on the path that I'm now.
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So, 12 years later, I'm still working as a health consultant.
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I love it.
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Anastasis, thanks for sharing that with us.
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So, from Greek special forces this is very impressive Greek special forces to banking, to yoga and health, and I know right now you are also a breathwork expert.
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Can you tell us about that?
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Of course, yeah.
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So it was 2015, probably when I was already working as a health consultant.
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I was teaching yoga at the time quite actively and I realized that my knowledge on breathing was missing.
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Some of our listeners probably are familiar with a Dutchman called Wim Hof.
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At the time he was not as popular as he is now, but so, anyway, I listened to a podcast of his and he said that how, in yoga, traditionally using our breath to control our body temperature is something that has been going on for thousands of years, but nowadays, yoga teachers primarily teach aerobics.
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And I said, okay, you know, I can relate to that.
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So this spoke to me and, as a result, I decided in 2016 to do his first international certification.
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Unfortunately for me, at the end of the certification, I didn't know anything yet because it was not taught there.
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But fast forward another two years.
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I studied with someone else, another teacher.
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I started finding some of the answers I was looking for Not everything yet and then it was when I realized that not everything I'm going to learn in this life, someone else will teach me Some things.
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I have to find the answer myself, and that's 2017.
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I started digging more into research.
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I was actively delivering workshops, consulting and through the research as well as the practice, I realized that, you know, maybe there is a system and there is an order into all of the breathwork and it's not like all of these segregated practices that they seem like opposing each other or making claims that some of them might be contradicting.
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So that's really my journey 2015 to now.
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Nine years, wow, wow, I just realized it's nine years.
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So, yes, nine years of my breadth journey.
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Congratulations.
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That is a journey indeed.
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Now, with your diverse experience in special forces and banking these high stress environments, how do you feel that it has shaped your approach to managing stress and anxiety through breathwork?
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As I was mentioning earlier, I was in my first job very much staying physical all of the time.
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In the second one, staying mentally active a lot of the time, and I think that there is a problem with both approaches.
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I think we cannot be one dimensional.
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We need to have equal stay actively, physically and mentally.
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You know, we're not two one-dimensional creatures, are we?
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And I think that's where sometimes stress comes through.
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A lot of people that do a lot of mental tasks, they will feel better when they exercise.
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A lot of people that do a lot of mental tasks they will feel better when they exercise.
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A lot of people that are very physically active, they benefit sometimes from meditation or from other spiritual practices.
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We see these patterns but we sometimes forget to make the link.
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So stress cannot be avoided.
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Stress, in my opinion, is part of life.
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There is no living being that does not deal with stress on a regular basis, and especially the ones that want to excel in life, the ones that have high aspirations, they probably have to deal with more stress than others.
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But then it's a matter of how we manage it, and I think that's really where breath actually comes in, as also in traditional yoga, but in other practices as practices well, breath will merge the mind and the body and I think someone does not need to give up his job.
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It does not need to follow a path similar to mine in order to be balanced and healthy.
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They can achieve it just by following simple practices frequently and you know they can keep their job at the end of the day, not change jobs like I did a few times.
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So you're saying that through learning these simple practices or coping mechanisms perhaps breath work it can help us through those environments that we're in, those stressful environments I think about pharmacists, especially in the retail setting, when they're an outpatient and they have people come into their store.
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Those tend to be most of the stressful positions as a pharmacist in that type of setting.
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So imagining that breath work, if they learn that technique, could actually help them through that day and through the various situations that come up throughout that day so they won't feel like they have to quit.
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That's very powerful.
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They can learn that technique.
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In addition to that, anastasis, a lot of listeners are intrigued by how genetic factors like SNPs and catecholamine breakdown enzymes, how this can affect anxiety, and I know this is something that you have some knowledge in.
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Can you tell us about that?
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Sure, I assume that a lot of our audience are already clued about what catecholamines are, and if someone is not familiar, we can call them, for simplicity, stress hormones.
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So these are the hormones that, in a way, help us deal with stress.
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At the same time, if they are not functioning as we wish, they will cause problems in how we deal with stress.
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If they are not functioning as we wish, they will cause problems in how we deal with stress.
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Now, to show that we don't oversimplify things, we need to keep in mind that it's not just the hormones themselves, how much they operate, how much they are produced, but it's also how they are broken down and for that reason, a lot of the times, the SNPs have to be looked into.
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As you said, their breakdown and even their SNPs related to their receptors.
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Now, we know that a lot of COMT patients, pmt, maui these are the most notorious, let's call them SNPs related with the broken down of a lot of our stress hormones, and the individuals that would have a lot of polymorphisms in these would be more susceptible to having problems with stress, having problems with stress.
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Now, a lot of people will be, of course, looking into supporting themselves for these SNPs through nutritional protocols and, of course, methylation support can go a long way, but I would say that anyone that knows that he or she carries these SNPs, I think it is valid to invest some time into some breathing, breath training.
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It might be not the most evident thing to look into, but let's face it.
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If I have problems with the breaking down of, let's say, adrenaline, right, I don't need to just rely on extra folate and B12 to help me upregulate COMT.
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I can, at the same time, upgrade, for example, acetylcholine that it can be upregulated by carbon dioxide and this can potentially balance the more sedative let's's call it neurotransmitter, the more like inhibiting neurotransmitter like acetylcholine or gaba, and, as a result, balance out the excess of adrenaline or some of the more activating exciting neurotransmitters thank you for explaining that, because it's interesting that our there, our breathing, can have that effect on those neurotransmitters and definitely affect the way that we break down, or those enzymes, so we can handle the hormones, so we can handle stress.
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Now there, to my understanding correct me if I'm wrong, because you are the expert there are different types of breathwork, different forms of breathwork.
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Is that correct, yep?
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Could you talk to us about that?
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Of course, any type of breathing exercise we're ever going to practice is going to affect our body, our body's biochemistry, in a very straightforward and predictable way.
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The blood has three gases oxygen, carbon dioxide and nitric oxide and, depending on how we breathe, this will stay within healthy levels or maybe will be off the healthy range.
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Now, nitric oxide is primarily going to be produced.
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Of course, there are breathing techniques that can increase the load, but as a general rule, it is primarily utilized when we are breathing from the nose.
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Any mouth engaging breathing technique will probably eliminate any use of nitric oxide.
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So then we are left with carbon dioxide and oxygen, and if someone was to put these into a matrix, they would see that there are basically only four ways that breathing exercise can affect these two gases.
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It can bring us into hypoxia, which is low oxygen, hyperoxia, which is primarily achieved through hyperbaric oxygen chamber, and then, as far as carbon dioxide goes, it could be into hypercapnia, which is elevated carbon dioxide, or hypocapnia, which is lower than normal.
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So I spoke a little bit fast.
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I don don't know, maybe some of the audience may want to rewind and hear this again, but ultimately that's what all breathing exercises come down to.
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You ignore that.
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And then it's like speaking about nutrition and ignoring macronutrients, right?
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You cannot do that, right, it's like you fall into some pitfalls.
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Yes, any breathing technique can be categorized as this.
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In my opinion, based on my experience and my research, breathwork at its heart is all about hypercapnia.
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It's about training our respiratory capacity to tolerate more carbon dioxide.
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On the back of this, someone will breathe more slowly, someone will breathe more calmly.
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Tons of research shows that people that have low tolerance to carbon dioxide are more prone to anxiety, panic attacks.
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People, even with bipolar I was speaking to a bipolar expert recently people that have bipolar disorder have been found to have, again, low tolerance to carbon dioxide.
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So it's really like saying, if you were to create a parallelism, that someone is weak and he's doing strength work like weak on a specific muscle.
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Now he's weak on his respiratory or her respiratory capacity.
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Hypercapnia is going to make him or her stronger.
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Interesting.
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It's going to make them stronger, so they have to work on that.
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Could you walk us through, like, for an example, say I were a client, have to work on that.
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Could you walk us through, like, for an example, say I were a client, I'm the stressed out pharmacist and I'm like honest.
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I says you know, when I'm at work I just sometimes just feel like I just can't handle the pressure anymore.
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What can I do in that instance?
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sure.
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So the first thing I would do would be an assessment, and an assessment would be like they would have two pillars the one would be on the biochemistry, which I've already spoken about, and the other one would be on the biomechanics.
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Imagine like an individual, when it comes to biomechanics, of have a very strong kyphosis around the shoulders.
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You see like the stress has taken its toll on this individual's body.
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You know, I'm sure we all know someone that is like especially older people maybe, but even young sometimes these days.
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You can see in their posture that they are stressed.
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But it might not be, it might be just on the biochemistry.
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So we assess this and, based on that, we can start giving some advice.
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But one thing that is very important is belief and faith and understanding how.
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I'm very big on educating my clients and helping them understand how these techniques are going to help them.
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I would probably one of the first things that I will do would be to explain the following, and this is an example I often give when discussing stress and anxiety A stressful situation can be perceived in a metaphorical way as the occurrence of an accident while someone is sailing.
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So if you stick with me for a second, imagine like we are sailing through the sea in the same way that we are sailing through life.
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That's a parallelism of the journey that we can have, and the stressful event is similar to the occurrence of the sailor being found in the sea fighting the waves.
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When the water is turbulent, they may feel overwhelmed, they may feel helpless, and in this parallelism we can think okay, if that's really what happens with stress, then how can breath help them?
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And there are two ways really.
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The first one, and the one that instinctively, most people will think about, is to make this individual a better swimmer.
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How can we get him or her to get back into the boat?
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How can he or she cope with the stress?
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And that's fine.
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There are breathing exercises.
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I'm happy to discuss them.
00:16:34.051 --> 00:16:51.434
But then there is a second group of exercises, which is to how good would that be if this individual can breathe in such a way that he or she is less likely to get himself into a state of overwhelmed and panic?
00:16:51.434 --> 00:16:57.152
And there would be different groups of exercises that would help them with that.
00:16:57.152 --> 00:17:09.864
As I've already hinted, in a way, people that have low tolerance of carbon dioxide are more likely to get themselves into panic attack and feel anxious and obviously you know the answer.
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Someone needs to do this type of training.
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But when it comes to helping someone cope with the event at the time, then there is a different group of exercises probably downregulate the nervous system, help someone feel safe, reduce heart rate and of course, many exercises can achieve that many breathing exercises thank you for explaining that.
00:17:29.885 --> 00:17:36.929
I never thought about it that way, in that there would be like preventative breathing, right?
00:17:36.929 --> 00:17:39.420
It sounds like what you're saying the way my mind thinks.
00:17:39.420 --> 00:17:53.467
It's like preventative breathing so that you don't get to that point of anxiety or stress, and then there's breathing when you are in that environment, in that moment of stress and anxiety that you would do, and what I'm hearing from you is that they're different.
00:17:53.467 --> 00:17:54.804
They're different techniques that you would use.
00:17:55.728 --> 00:18:05.811
All right and, as you said, like a lot of people would think instinctively and they are right, they are not wrong that we can help us deal with stress at the time.
00:18:05.811 --> 00:18:13.807
But don't we know some people that they have had to manage so much stress in their life and they didn't feel overwhelmed, they never felt like helpless?
00:18:13.807 --> 00:18:20.765
And of course I'm not saying that is just the way that they breathe better, but maybe the way they breathe is also different.
00:18:21.307 --> 00:18:25.047
That's true Interesting Learning something new everyone.
00:18:25.047 --> 00:18:26.244
I hope you're taking notes.
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Thank you, anastasis.
00:18:27.761 --> 00:18:29.464
Now something else I want to get into.
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You mentioned that you can use breathwork as a tool for assisting patients with autoimmune conditions and as well as cancer survivors.
00:18:38.500 --> 00:18:42.826
Can you talk about that, how breathwork supports their recovery and resilience?
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supports their recovery and resilience.
00:18:45.430 --> 00:18:56.506
Sure, and again, to avoid coming up with exaggerated claims, I believe that these techniques are going to complement other parts of a protocol.
00:18:56.506 --> 00:18:59.576
I don't suggest anyone to rely on breathing to recover from any of these conditions.
00:18:59.576 --> 00:19:22.105
I'm going to share with you a study and I'm pretty sure it was a 2017 study and what they found is that cancer survivors that practice breathing exercises and actually what they did is they asked them to do a simple test that I can describe for you, if you want, in order to quantify their breathing, in order to quantify the quality of their breath, I should say so.
00:19:22.105 --> 00:19:24.112
They measured, they assessed their breath.
00:19:24.112 --> 00:19:35.383
The ones that did breathing exercises that helped them improve their score in this test had a significantly longer life expectancy than the ones that didn't like.
00:19:35.383 --> 00:19:39.421
Significantly I don't remember if it was 60 percent more or even more than double.
00:19:39.421 --> 00:19:43.851
So we are talking about, like, a big sample.
00:19:43.851 --> 00:19:47.680
Some of them, they did breathing exercises first thing in the morning.
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They measured their score, they improved their breathing, they lived longer.
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Second group everything else the same.
00:19:53.862 --> 00:19:56.186
So this is number one.
00:19:56.567 --> 00:20:04.048
But you know we spoke about, about the immune conditions and, like you can think about, like overall, like health conditions.
00:20:04.769 --> 00:20:11.299
I sure you, a lot of our listeners, are very familiar with the importance of mitochondrial health.
00:20:11.740 --> 00:20:20.934
We know that mitochondria sit at the heart of the energy warehouses of our body, sit at the heart of a lot of conditions.
00:20:21.019 --> 00:20:26.692
Sometimes I would say to patients like if your body has enough energy, they would manage to fight the disease.
00:20:27.039 --> 00:20:29.288
If it is low in energy, it will not.
00:20:29.288 --> 00:20:50.267
So if the function of the mitochondria is so important, then very quickly then someone can realize that the products that the mitochondria need in order to function well are equally important for their health and function, and these are really glucose or fatty acids, depending on the metabolic state that one is, and also oxygen.
00:20:50.267 --> 00:21:06.515
So if we think of it this way, then the delivery of oxygen to our cells are going to be detrimental to the survival of our mitochondria and, sequentially, to the evolution of the disease.
00:21:06.515 --> 00:21:27.269
So while there was this study for cancer patients and there have been a couple of more, unfortunately most of the studies are indirect and we have so many autoimmune conditions Unfortunately we don't even have enough research for a lot of other, more traditional protocols for them.
00:21:27.269 --> 00:21:44.592
But based on this logic, I think it is safe to say that breath work can support people with autoimmune condition and cancer, as a complement to everything else that people are doing nice.
00:21:44.652 --> 00:21:45.854
Thank you for explaining that.
00:21:45.854 --> 00:21:46.535
That definitely as a compliment.
00:21:46.535 --> 00:21:47.215
Yeah, I'm glad that you are doing.
00:21:47.215 --> 00:21:48.397
Thank you for explaining that.
00:21:48.397 --> 00:21:49.259
That definitely is a compliment.
00:21:49.259 --> 00:22:00.207
Yeah, I'm glad that you made that disclaimer, that you're not saying that this is it, that's all you need, but as a compliment, in addition to other means of treating these conditions.
00:22:00.259 --> 00:22:02.208
But potentially significant one, right?
00:22:02.208 --> 00:22:10.486
Because even I mean, I wholeheartedly believe what I just said, but I think oxygenation is very important of ourselves.
00:22:10.486 --> 00:22:16.631
But even if we want to take a step back, how many people that are unwell are worried, stressed, anxious?
00:22:16.631 --> 00:22:23.095
So even if we take it back to the just the anxiety level of the disease, even on that level it's going to help.
00:22:23.095 --> 00:22:28.364
But I think it actually goes a step further, as I just explained amazing, right down to the cellular level.
00:22:29.547 --> 00:22:45.682
Yeah, now there's a question I always like to ask all my guests on this office um, when it comes to culture and cultural differences, I know that you have workshops that have reached people all over the world in various countries, and many of whom may have unique cultural perspectives on wellness.
00:22:45.682 --> 00:22:51.667
Could you share an insight or a story about how different cultures perceive and practice breathwork?
00:22:52.288 --> 00:23:03.096
Yeah, I think you're very right, and there are big cultural differences, but at the same time, we're all humans and we're all susceptible to the same laws of nature, so to speak.
00:23:03.096 --> 00:23:18.070
What I find is that when people come from backgrounds where they have this approach I would not call it necessarily militant, but structured approach they are taking things let's say, quote unquote seriously.
00:23:18.070 --> 00:23:21.588
They are the ones that they go a very long way.
00:23:21.588 --> 00:23:25.089
They are the ones that see the benefits long term.
00:23:25.089 --> 00:23:35.226
And, on the other hand, when we have people that they just like to sample things, I find, for example, that a lot of indians tend to take breathing very seriously.
00:23:35.226 --> 00:23:45.442
Maybe it's also part of their tradition that through yoga, and maybe their ancestors did practice breathing exercises, maybe not in a structured way, but, you know, maybe they practice a lot.
00:23:45.442 --> 00:23:48.126
You know it's part of the yoga tradition.
00:23:48.126 --> 00:23:51.213
I think they tend to practice Chinese people as well.
00:23:51.961 --> 00:23:54.087
Also, it comes down to the individual.
00:23:54.087 --> 00:23:58.682
I had the American clients and they were very serious about their sport.
00:23:58.682 --> 00:24:10.164
So it happened and they were some of them were amateur athletes and when it comes to being motivated towards a specific outcome, they were also quite dedicated and committed to it.
00:24:10.164 --> 00:24:14.823
I think, like everything else, like you know a lot of the things that you advise your clients.
00:24:14.823 --> 00:24:20.685
When they follow them by the book, according to your guidelines, they go a long way.
00:24:20.685 --> 00:24:31.888
When they are casually like tipping their toes in and out of of them, then, yes, the results might not be as evident, but still, some results will still come yeah, that's so true, that is so true.
00:24:32.611 --> 00:24:34.782
And, um, thank you for sharing that with us.
00:24:34.782 --> 00:24:39.579
And you're right, we're all human, so we're going to respond in similar ways again.
00:24:39.579 --> 00:25:01.864
It does come down to genetics, as we mentioned earlier, right with with those SNPs, but ultimately, that belief in it to want to do the work, want to take it seriously, versus just dabbling in it it does make a difference when they approach it with the perspective of they're going to make this part of their life versus, oh, I'm just going to try it out and see what happens.
00:25:01.864 --> 00:25:06.493
So their attitude towards doing it does make a difference.
00:25:06.493 --> 00:25:10.830
Final question I have for you on a stasis is what advice do you have?
00:25:10.830 --> 00:25:16.759
Because I know for you you confronted your own health crisis and you went on your path for self-healing.
00:25:16.759 --> 00:25:23.394
What advice would you have for those in similar situations who are on the brink of their own health turning points?
00:25:24.259 --> 00:25:27.512
Belief Don't give up of their own health turning points.
00:25:27.512 --> 00:25:28.256
Belief don't give up.
00:25:28.256 --> 00:25:50.871
One of the things that I pay attention to when I speak with clients is to hear, when they're describing their problem is, if they have given up, if they have come in terms that they will live with the problem forever, or if they are just there to get some more insights, to help themselves, get a step closer to health and ultimately go back into the life that they want to have.
00:25:50.871 --> 00:25:53.008
I think that's by far the biggest one.
00:25:53.008 --> 00:25:57.731
Unfortunately, sometimes media maybe terrorize people.
00:25:57.731 --> 00:26:10.559
They present some conditions as incurable Some conditions might be, but let's not forget that there are so many miracles that happen every day, even in this incurable condition.
00:26:10.559 --> 00:26:21.476
So you know, like let's have belief and faith and like let's look for everything that can contribute to us getting back to the best life we have.
00:26:22.059 --> 00:26:24.345
For this, if I may ask, I do do one thing.
00:26:24.345 --> 00:26:26.169
A useful thing is to dream.
00:26:26.169 --> 00:26:34.501
A lot of the times, even relatively early in the process of consulting, I'm asking my clients let's say that you had all the energy that you want.
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Let's say that anxiety was not the problem.
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